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    « An antidote has arrived | Main | Friday Fun and flogometer for Karen—would you turn the page? »

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    Comments

    jon

    Hiya, Luca!

    For me, the prologue was a yes based on subject matter (weird cults underground = potential icktastic fun) but very nearly a no based on the writing.

    The first chapter, however, was a good read but was still a no for me, based on the fact that I didn't feel any sort of empathy for the character about to face the fight, and that starting the story with a fight is cliche enough (sorry) to make me expect more of the same throughout.

    (Oddly, I think Unther's beginning might have worked perfectly well for me as a prologue... that's not terribly useful for you, but still... :o) )

    Overall, the sentence-level writing in both sections was quite good - nice variety in structure, good punctuation. The sentences did feature a little over-writing, though, and many should (IMO) be pruned.

    Okay, details:

    Prologue

    The sentences in the first paragraph seemed to me to have little to do with one another, and at the end resorted to narrative telling that nearly lost me right there.

    The second paragraph is inconsistent - she's mastered the distancing-trick, but can't call it up here. That's not mastery, then, is it?

    Lenghty digression on the physical stuff in this paragraph: Regarding the whip, we have "corded" whip, which implies a bullwhip, and "wrapped around her waist" which solidifies it... but it's written as "lengths" which implies multiple strands. Also, while I've never been hit with anything other than fists and feet and knees and such (Muay Thai, get your minds out of the gutter), I can't see a bullwhip's strike being pleasant for -anyone- -- even, if I understand correctly, masochists get pleasure from the aftereffects of the pain (e.g., pain, then pleasure as the endorphins kick in), not from the pain itself. People have been flogged to -death- with a bullwhip. I can't see sighs of pleasure as a direct result.

    All that said, her finding what she's doing repulsive raised interesting story questions in my mind - I assume she's some kind of undercover agent sent in to break up the cult? If that assumption is correct, then the last two sentences in paragraph 1 are actually her thoughts, not the narrator's... but I didn't get that until reading to paragraph 3. Probably not a good idea. (And perhaps the reason why stories generally start with a character in the first sentence, so readers know how to attribute the maybe-narrator, maybe-character observations...)

    The cult would be "depraved," I imagine, not "deprived."

    The fourth paragraph now seems clearly in her head, not the narrator's, so the observations there don't bug me as much. It's overwritten, though -- I'd find a way to trim some of the redundancy in sentences 1-3, were it mine.

    The ending of the fourth paragraph reinforced the "secret agent" idea for me.

    The fifth paragraph seemed kind of out of left field for me. Nice grounding in the details, though. The image of sweating walls and slick wooden floor was a good sensory image. (I wouldn't have minded knowing what the walls were made of, though.)

    I'd recommend (without seeing the rest):

    1. Starting from Nadia, then building outward. Currently the piece goes:

    (1) Girl > (2) Nadia conscious thought > (2) Nadia physical sensations and actions > (2) girl's reactions > (3) Nadia conscious thought > (4) Surroundings > (4) Nadia conscious thought > (5) Surroundings

    I'd restructure so it maybe goes:

    (1) Nadia physical sensations and actions* > (2) Girl's reaction > (2/3) Nadia's thought about girl's reaction > (4) Nadia's physical reaction, interacting with environment > (5) Surroundings

    *Starting with Nadia establishes viewpoint and a concrete reference.

    2) Nailing down the physical references currently in par 2 - important for authenticity.

    3) Trimming down the (what I think of as) overwriting and redundancy in the paragraph currently located at #4.

    4) Note that, despite all of the above, I would have turned the page here. I wanted to know who Nadia was and why she was down here -- that story question dragged me on past all the problems I had with the actual writing.

    Chapter 1

    I'd flip paragraphs 1 and 2. I think that flows better. And leading with "Unther's sight had lost..." is a nice, atypical lead that gives us instant empathy with the character. (If you do this, I'd rework sentence 1 in the new par2 to eliminate the "Unther" leading both paragraphs. Par 3 would also need a bit of touchup, since it's no longer answering par 2.)

    I do have a question as to what light Unther was traveling by - is it the moon? a torch? I don't have a light source here, and if there are Big Bads in the woods I'd expect him to really really want a light source...

    Paragraph 4, "clear and white" raises images of cataracts in my head - I'd expect some sort of aversion reaction in Unther when he sees this.

    Paragraph 5, I'd maybe try to condense the description of the man.

    All that said, there's nothing significantly 'wrong' with the writing or pace of the Ch1 beginning... it's just an opening that I'm not particularly attracted to for the reasons outlined at the beginning of my post. It's good writing, well-paced and readable. I just have concerns that agents and readers will say "-another- fight beginning?" ... but, on the other hand, that it's so common means that it works for a lot of those agents and readers. Use your judgment... :o)

    Thanks for sharing! Hope this helps!

    -Jon


    Doug

    Prologue:

    I don't like prologues. Unless the prologue contains information that I need to know in order to make sense of the first couple of paragraphs of chapter 1, there's plenty of room to work the prologue into the body of the novel.

    Somewhat interesting subject matter, but the treatment didn't work for me. It was too distant. A close 3rd PoV from Nadia would have been able to cover much of the same territory while being more engaging.

    Opening with "She" is unnecessary. Give me the name. As it stands, I'm not sure whether the "she" in the first paragraph is Nadia or the 'girl' being whipped.

    The double-negative in the second sentence, "nothing if not sure", made me backtrack to figure out exactly what was meant. Just "sure" would do.

    Ditto Jon's comment on the failed mastery.

    The third paragraph uses "could feel" twice. As a general rule, "could" means "could have but didn't". The simple past tense "felt" would work better, perhaps as "still felt".

    I doubt that the whip handle was "solid leather". I think that a comma is missing: "thick, solid, leather handle".

    On the other hand, the comma in "girl's back, and" doesn't belong there. The verbs "hissed" and "wrapped" both refer back to the corded lengths.

    How old is that 'girl', anyway? Is Nadia whipping a child?

    The first four sentences of the fourth paragraph each tell us that the temple is secret. Telling us once would be enough. Those four sentences could be collapsed into one or maybe two.

    Ditto Jon on "deprived".

    I'm not a fan of a cult "squirming". I can't visualize that at all.

    The phrase "Innocent, as much as any common populace" didn't add anything and could be dropped.

    The first two sentences of the last paragraph on the page don't go together. She's kneeling in the slick and warm floor, and the floor seeped into her skin? (I also question why a dank temple located underground is warm, but maybe there's a fire going somewhere.)

    In the final sentence, there should be a comma after "Around her".

    Sorry, Luca, but the prologue wasn't even a close call for me except for the subject matter.

    Doug

    Chapter 1:

    Much better, and I voted 'yes'.

    I'd rather that we start with a story-worthy conflict, but some bridging action like this is okay. My personal taste would be to use this scene to show us a little bit more about Unther; for example, the line about his eyesight that Ray took out. :-)

    I'll half-way agree with Jon about the first two paragraphs. I generally like them in the order that they're in, but I want Unther's eyesight issue in the opening line. And maybe a bit of explanation for his eyesight problem. Here's what I'm thinking:
    ---------------
    Unther was certain he'd seen something skulking in the trees by the side of the road, but age had caused his sight to lose some of its clarity, particularly at night.
    ---------------
    That also tells us right away that the scene is at night. (I also slipped in a contraction.)

    Having appointed myself Sheriff of Participial Phrases (oh look, there's one now!), I grated across the second and third sentences. I'll give you the first one, but I'm going to extend Ray's suggestion on the third sentence to make it "Unther patted his neck and whispered to soothe him."

    Remove the comma in "the blackness, and". The verbs "squinted" and "strained" both refer back to the subject "He".

    That should be "besides the rain", not "beside".

    Ditto on Ray's removal of the redundant "They appeared slowly".

    After the shadows "stepped hesitantly", one of them then "stalked" out onto the roadway? What happened to their hesitation?

    The "at last" isn't needed. Just "... and Unther saw him clearly." You'll also notice I've killed another "could".

    Him/it--I'm confused: "see HIM clearly at last. IT was a ‘HIM’, not an ‘IT’.

    I'm not able to form a picture of a "half naked" man whose body is "oddly wrapped". If he's half-naked, I expect that almost all of his body is exposed. Also, the word "oddly" doesn't tell me anything.

    Drop the comma in "skin, where it was exposed". Ray did so but didn't mention it.

    The phrase "The man paused, a few feet clear of the tree-line, and regarded Unther" has a number of problems. I don't think the man "paused". He probably "stopped". There shouldn't be a comma after "paused". I thought he was already in the roadway, so the "a few feet clear of the tree-line" just disoriented me. There shouldn't be a comma after "tree-line", because the verbs "paused" and "regarded" both refer back to "The man".

    The final bit has a participial phrase "his face split by a wide grin" that isn't clear as to whether it refers to the man or to Unther.

    How about something like this?
    ---------------
    The man stopped in front of Unther and his face split into a wide grin. Unther caught the glint of a blade in the man’s hand.
    ---------------

    I'm supposing that Unther is not your average person, who would've pushed his heels into Reckless and gotten the heck out of there at the first hint of trouble. :-)

    I went with 'yes' on this, but it does have room for being cleaned up.

    Lexi Revellian

    There do seem to be a lot of books around that begin with violence against women - this example, I should say, is mild compared to many - and I find them distasteful.

    I'm worried by the idea that you are going to sell it to the sort of person who will pick it up in a bookshop and say, 'Oh, this looks interesting...'

    Lesley

    Whipping women doesn't do anything for me, so I would not turn the page.

    Reckless whickered and stopped, nostrils flaring.

    The adjective 'reckless' confused me. I had to read the sentence several times.
    Whereas,'Pinto the pony whickered and stopped, nostrils flaring', would have been perfectly clear.

    The next line, of course, adds clarity.

    Unther patted his neck, ...

    A small thing I know and probably only me having a problem with it.

    Jami G.

    Ray, Jon, and Doug have already given you lots of great advice. I agree with many of their suggestions.

    I'd say 'no' to the Prologue. I, too, was confused on if the 'she' in paragraph one was the same person as Nadia. It's too distant in that it seems like it's talking "around" things instead of "about" things. Maybe you did that on purpose because of the subject matter, but it just ends up making things confusing and unclear. It looks like an immediate scene, but it reads like an omniscient comment on the world at large. I'm sorry, it's hard to describe what I didn't like about it. Hopefully, something in that mess is helpful.

    I liked your chapter one much better. This is written with much clearer sentences and description.

    Jean

    The prologue was a no for me, not because of the violence but because of the lack of clarity.

    The first chapter was a no for me too. Like Lesley, I got tripped up in Reckless being the name of the horse. Maybe if the name was used in the second sentence after we are aware of the horse stopping, it would be clear right away. Beyond that, it was many of the same things Ray pointed out and others have already covered.

    Bree

    I only have one thing to add to the wealth of comments ahead of mine. I noticed that many of your sentences have the same basic structure. Over and over again it seemed, I was hearing "Unther did this", "Unther did that". The rhythm started to plod along in my head. I would try to break up the pattern by finding places where you can change the subject of the sentence from Unther to something different.

    Same thing happened to a lesser extent with Reckless. That one's an even easier fix: call him Reckless the first time, then refer to him as the horse (or as Unther's horse), then you can go back to calling him by name.

    Just mix it up a little more. Good writing overall. I would turn the page.

    Kathy

    For me, the character is dead. What does he feel about all of this? Is he terrified by the shadows coming alive? Is he angry at his failing sight? I believe you need to infuse more emotion into the text to liven this up.

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