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    « Flogometer for Terri: would you keep reading? | Main | Flogometer for Linda: would you keep reading »

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    Comments

    Deana

    I have to say, I'm surprised at Ray's comments here. To me, the piece was waaaay overwritten, and this is usually something Ray hones in on.

    For instance, the opening sentence. It doesn't do any of the things Ray usually looks for. It's passive and wordy, and the story isn't about goats.

    I wouldn't have read past the first paragraph, but, having done so, I have to agree with Ray that the scene could have been compelling.

    kathy

    I agree with Deana, although the writing was very good it seemed more like poetry. I could not read 300-400 pages.

    Sheila

    I liked the descriptions of the storm and the young man up on the mountain watching his village brace for its arrival. I felt sympathy for this guy.

    I've never seen a cloud with a dark green belly, that made me wonder. Also, the construction "was being" is one to avoid. It's passive. Try turning that sentence around - "the storm's shadow chased the late afternoon sun westward." And then, at the end, the storm is creeping into the valley, whereas, in the first paragraph, it is described as the kind of storm that blew in quickly.

    I think I would have read a bit further, but if more craft issues popped up (like the head hopping Ray mentioned) I would put it down.

    Good luck!

    Ray Rhamey

    On "overwritten:" there's a style issue here. Epic fantasies are frequently "rich" with language and expression, some more than others. I try to avoid interfering too much with a writer's voice, and that "fantasy voice" is what's happening here.

    Could I have trimmed it down to match my own lean style? Absolutely. Would it be the right thing to do? I don't think so. If the prose began to get in the way of story, I would advise my client. For me, this style was acceptable as long as there was compelling story.

    And thus we experience again the enormously subjective nature of reading and editing. And genre differences, as well. A "chick lit" voice could be very jarring in an epic fantasy (though it might be fun to try).

    For what it's worth.

    AnnG

    Thanks for the flogging and the comments!

    I might need some explanation of the head-hopping. I get the idea that there's a problem with perspective going on, but am not clear on it enough to address it.

    Deana & kathy: I'll review for over-writing. I was trying to get some visuals in, and might have tried *too* hard! I can see some kind of tangled sentences already.

    I'm actually pleased that Ray got the impression of an epic fantasy, which is what I was going for. I like and appreciate his comments, and can probably have less goats and more tension. It's hard to build up to the point where Something happens (which I think is the second page), and in writing (4 chapters so far), I feel the pace is perhaps too fast. Adding details like the goats kind of slows it down, but perhaps in the wrong way.

    Thanks again! I've found the whole site very helpful, especially reading comments and critiques of other stories.

    AnnG

    NOTE: Never mind on the head-hopping, a search of the site came up with links explaining it. :) Will read and ponder.

    Ray Rhamey

    Here are links to a couple of FtQ posts on "head hopping," which is jumping from within one character's point of view to another's within a scene, and with no transitions. This is done, however, in the omniscient POV, but not a good idea in close third person. The links:

    http://www.floggingthequill.com/flogging_the_quill/2004/12/an_executive_ed.html

    http://www.floggingthequill.com/flogging_the_quill/2004/12/flogging_point_.html

    Kami

    I wouldn't have read on. I agree with the already mentioned craft issues with sentences trying to do too much at once. Also, as an owner of goats, I can't imagine them doing anything except panicking and getting tangled if they're tied together in any way shape or form. Also, it's bad to manipulate goats by their horns. Their instinct is to fight any push or pull on their horns (and horns have been known to break! At which point they'll bleed like crazy.) Maybe this would work if they'd been raised with that kind of handling, but I've never heard of it and so it tossed me out of the story.

    It's easiest to just have a harness on one goat, some treats in your pocket, and they'll follow you and the 'lead' goat everywhere. Also, once goats learn to trust their shepherd they'll tend to crowd to that person in times of strife. It's very handy to have a dog in case they panic because in a panic situation they may simply scatter and at that point a person will be unable to keep them together. It might even be iffy for a dog at that point. The key is to keep moving. Once you stop they interpret that as goof-off time. If you keep moving they may dawdle but eventually they'll worry about falling behind and missing out on treats and will dash after you (and proceed to get in your way.)

    My goaty ten cents. :D Your mileage may vary. I certainly don't know all there is about goats and goat handling!

    mai

    I liked the setting, the slightly archaic tone, the details, the tension of the coming storm and the way Amar resists his fears. Some details didn't work for me. Sheep might need to be tethered, gathered or corralled against a storm, but goats are smart and hardy, and don't panic about weather, as a rule. In fact, cross-tying a flock of goats is a recipe for disaster, given their wiliness and agility -- and it's something a one or two herders couldn't handle alone, even if they were unwise enough to try it. Would there be barns in the city? I think granaries, storehouses and animal shelters, surely, but what we think of as barns wouldn't fit into the tight requirements of buildings in what we think of as cities, even old ones... unless the barns are on the outskirts(?). Some of the phrasing in the third paragraph is a little convoluted -- for example, "Amar, at seventeen and a half, didn't like to think of himself as unwary, and studied...". The two halves of this sentence are not parallel enough for an "and" to work before the section that starts with "studied".

    I'm a fan of this kind of writing, and despite my quibbles, this opening is good enough that I'd have turned the page.

    mai

    Ah, reading others' comments now, specifically Sheila's remark about the green-bellied cloud... I saw such a storm once -- it was a heavy (big-time low pressure & tornadic winds) storm, on a very late summer afternoon, that approached a ridge of hills (I was on top of one of them) that had tops about 2000 feet above sea level. The clouds were maybe another 1000 feet above that. During sunset, you can sometimes see a thin strip of green in the sky -- I think in this storm, the same conditions that produce the green sunset light were hitting the clouds -- light a certain angle, at a certain time of day, at a particular altitude.

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